Live Blog Of MSNBC Republican Debate In Florida (January 24, 2007)

7:30: Time Russert and Brian Williams (henceforth, Bri-Wi) are moderating this debate, and participating are John McCain, Mitt Romney, Rudy Giuliani, Mike Huckabee, and Ron Paul. I’m looking for Huckabee and Giuliani to be particularly aggressive, as a bad finish in Florida could really hurt them.

As an aside, today is the one year anniversary of this little site. So for those of you who have stuck around for all 1,053 posts now, I’m sure you realize how damned lucky you are to have us. But enough about us, you’re here to see two old white men question five other old white men about who should replace another old white man. How thrilling!

8:46: MSNBC says the debate is “DO OR DIE.” in large all-cap font. Note this, because your children will want to know about the time that four presidential candidates were all killed on stage by a major news company. In other words, don’t expect this debate to be a subtle discussion of minor differences.

8:59: Want to skip us as middlemen and watch it yourself but don’t have cable? Screw you! Seriously, though, watch here. Brian Williams just told people not to cheer to give people at home misleading impressions. And now he’s thanking military people in the audience.

9:01: Lyndon Johnson was at the university when it opened. Hillary Clinton just issued a press release that it takes a president to open a school.

9:02: Candidates are tired; apparently, they requested the debate only goes 90 minutes instead of 2 hours at their request. Tim Russert looks angry.

9:03: Romney is asked about the stimulus plan, and contrasts it with Bush’s. Is he disappointed? Romney says it is effective, he just wishes it went further. Romney somehow says that a permanent tax cut is equivalent to a rebate or no taxes on capital gains. Talks about creating jobs and the mortgage crisis. He sounds like he’s somewhat competant, but pandering at the same time.

9:05: McCain says he will vote for the plan, and is disappointed it does not make the Bush tax cuts permanent. McCain talks about people having uncertainty in their budget for 2010, and it sounds like a punch line. Segues into pork barrel talk. Talks up the rate cuts by Bernanke and the need for tax cuts. He’s completely trying to erase any doubts of him on the tax issue.

9:07: Giuliani says the package is OK, but does not go far enough. Talks up his surrogates introducing legislation (Dreier and Bond). Says there is no difference between temporary and permanent. Says that if America over taxes, spends, sues, or regulates that America loses. Specifically excludes military spending. Said he is worried about London overtaking NYC as financial center.

9:09: McCain is asked about a quote that said he did not know the economy well enough. He flatly denies the quote and says he is well versed. Cites support of Jack Kemp and Phil Gramm and his experience in the Senate on the “Congress committee.” I’m not sure about any of the credentials he’s mentioning here.

9:11: Does Huckabee trust Romney on taxes or fees? What an awfulo question. Huckabee demurs, and says its about voters. He talks up him balancing the budget. Huckabee says that we’ll borrow money for the package from China and buy Chinese packages (Did Duncan Hunter take over as speech writer?) Huckabee says that a bigger priority ought be building infrastructure, and says 95 should be widened. I’d love to know his plan for widening the Cross Bronx.

9:13: Does Romney trust McCain and Giuliani on taxes? He says he respects them despite differences but share a common goal. Cites his bipartisanship in solving problems without raising taxes. Talks about the surplus. Criticizes McCain for not voting for the Bush tax cuts the first time, and says that the POTUS needs to understand the private sector like he does.

9:15: McCain says that the people who had fees raised by Romney thought they were a tax increase. Flat joke. Talks at length about needing to cut spending to cut taxes at first. Talks at length about pork barrel spending.

9:17: Paul is brought in and asked about government intervention. Says the fed cutting interest rates and printing money is the problem. Says less regulations and taxes is the problem. The dollar is crashing and it’s hurting foreign policy, and we’re spending money on an empire, etc. Criticizes no one cutting money overseas.

9:18: This is very antiseptic, with almost no interaction between candidates. Bri-Wi asks Giuliani about banks borrowing money from overseas. Giuliani first talks about his trip to Ground Zero with a Saudi prince, when he found out that the prince criticized American foreign policy. Says that is fundamentally different from investments where there is no other reasons behind it, and a mutuality of interest. Moves in Japan buying into America that brough Japan and America closer together. Wants America to sell something to the world. Not sure what, exactly.

9:21: A poll showed Democrats with an 18 point lead of trust on the economy. Russert lkists a bunch of stats that showed problems with the economy over the past 6 years. McCain says Democrats will increase government and raise spending, calling that ’straight talk.’ He just mentioned 10 minutes ago that the Bush administration was the worst at increasing the size of government since LBJ, and now that? He concludes by talking about taxes and Democrats like he’s a 5 year old.

9:24: Huckabee takes credit for not being in Washington. Then says it’s not all on Bush as he kept us safe. Huckabee takes credit for being the only one to say the economy was doing bad at the CNBC economic debate a few months ago. Huckabee says that trickle down may be true, but trickle-up is a sign of a bad economy coming. Funny, but conservatives probably won’t buy it.

9:25: Romney takes the bold stance of running on his record. Attacks Washington and says promises are never met. Cites spending, Social Security, immigration, and foreign oil. Blames both parties, and says Republicans are the party of change.

9:27: Giuliani says he is the only one to turn around an economy. And yes, Huckabee and Romney both took credit for a turnaround earlier. Cites his stimulus plan being touted by the Club for Growth.

9:28: Paul says he cannot be identified with a high spending crowd, but Republicans need to fix their goals. Says America is moving into a new era. Sure, I guess.

9:29: Local question for McCain, about the military being on the verge of breaking and the economy being on the edge of breaking. How will McCain manage staying in Iraq militarily and economically? He says no one in the military says we cannot stay. Attacks Clinton for wanting to withdraw. Says no one complains about troops around the world a mere ten minutes after Paul complained. Dodges the economic issue completely.

9:31: Barry McCaffrey says the army is too small and needs to be doubled. How do you do that without a draft. Romney says that he wants to add 100k. He says he incentivized it in Ma, and the GI Bill needs to be better funded. Segues into attacking Democrats for prioritizing getting out over winning in Iraq. Worried about Al Qaeda taking over Iraq, then says safe haven. Says Clinton is arrogant for taking credit of the surge, that it is the blood of troops and Petraeus, not “Gen. Hillary Clinton.” Apparently Florida is Clinton bashing territory.

9:34: Will you go to the country and say the war was worth it? McCain says it was worth getting rid of Hussein, and mishandling the war was the problem. Russert presses him on it being a good idea, and McCain repeats the answer and says yes (stupid Russert question). Giuliani attacks answers on polls. Giuliani attacks Clinton for going with the polls. Wow, Hillary bashing gone overtime. Talks about polls not pushing you around.

9:36: Paul says it was a bad idea to a smattering of applause (clearly NOT a majority). Cites the 1998 resolution. Does not want America to start wars.

9:37: Huckabee says he and “the Democrats” supported Bush; talked about the ‘potential’ of WMD and compares them somehow to damn easter eggs. Says you cannot second guess.

9:38: Romney steals McCain’s talking points on the issue. MSNBC thankfully shows McCain nearly laughing. He’s worried about Al Qaeda being a ’superpower.’ Says now is more important than ‘the beginning.’

Bri-Wi scolds the audience for applauding, and we go to a break.

They accidentally leave the mic on, and Russert tells Williams that he finds something unbelievable. Probably the drollness of the questioning.

9:43: Williams is angry candidates went off stage during the break. Candidates question each other! Romney talks about the rise of China and Asia and being a tougher competition. To Giuliani: How do we protect American industry in this light; how do we compete economically. Giuliani jokes that he won’t answer. Giuliani talks about getting to know a country through trade. I’m waiting for him to talk about getting to second base. Instead he talks about the ability to sue in China. Says people coming out of poverty are potential customers. Again with the used car salesman technique. Says China needs to buy what we have. What is that? Who knows! Segues to the military, and attacks Bill Clinton for the peace dividend of cutting the military. Really all out on Clinton tonight. That’s almost verbatim from Romney’s stump speech at the end.

9:46: McCain goes for the jugular on the Fair Tax. He asks Huckabee about a sales tax costing more of the lower class burdens and what accounts for the resonance. Huckabee says it ends nonsense of the IRS. Huckabee says the prebate in the FairTax solves those regressive problems. Poor choice for McCain; you cannot criticize the FairTax in this forum. Says that pimps and drug dealers will now pay taxes, and jokes they are non-Republicans. I’m not sure about those though. They’re businessman at heart!

9:50: Russert asks about those paying 15% or less compared to 30% in the flat tax. Huckabee talks about a hidden corporate tax in every products. He’s not an economist.

9:51: Paul to McCain, and he’s thrilled. Paul is asked about a Presidential Group on Economics and if we will know what they are doing. McCain jokes that everyone wants to see more sunshine. Again goes back to Kemp and Gramm. He’s looking worse and worse on the economy by the second by having to answer a second question. He goes back to Phil Gramm AGAIN for a 1982 tax cut. Says he would rely on him.

9:53: Huckabee says that Romney supported the 2nd Amendment and the ban on assault weapon ban and Brady. Romney says the ban at hand was from the lobbies coming together, and compares himself to Bush on the issue. He now says we need no new legislation. He supported a ban that did not pass and now says that we need no new legislation? I’m confused.

9:55: Giuliani asks Romney about a national catastrophic fund, attacking McCain two or three times for not supporting it. McCain interjects about who the question is for. Romney says that he does support some sort of effort to provide insurance against disasters. Talks about people who live in both Florida and Massachusetts. Ah, now we’re in a Republican debate. Says no subsidization should be involved. Compares the unworkable economics to what he did in health insurance. Giuliani asks about mandates and Romney says that’s different. He either sounds like he doesn’t know anything or he is a master, depending on your perspective.

9:58: McCain for some reason gets only 30 seconds. Says there are other ways to solve and the bill being passed is just a handout. Says he’ll get everyone together. 1,000 people together is going to make something MORE workable?

9:59: Giuliani is asked about global warming and not accepting a cap on greenhouse gases. He says that you need new technology, citing nuclear power, that new and exciting technology. And clean coal. Talks incentives for new industries. Gives a laundry list of other programs. Compares to the man on the moon, in what may have been taken from the line in Clinton’s stump speech. In reality, it just shows when they both grew up.

10:01: McCain says he’s in favor of cap and trade. Says a global agreement has to include India and China. He says global warming is real and could affect Florida. Says it’s a win even if there is no climate change.

The last break, this time without mics left on.

10:06: Bri-Wi laughs in Giuliani’s face about his doubt in polls, and asks Giuliani about falling polls and terrible results. Compares himself to the NY Giants lulling people into a false sense of superiority. I find it amusing he deems how he has been crushed as “close” but, you know, more power to you, Rudy.

10:08: McCain is asked about the GOP getting behind him when a lot of people do not like him, citing a quote by his mother. Says he got Alito and Roberts through and he won Republicans in NH and SC. Mentions climate change and Israel. Says that he is proud to be a conservative but there are times to stand up, citing Rummy, the bridge to nowhere, and Abramoff. Says his country comes before his country.

10:10: Romney is asked about Bill Clinton and says he is scared of Bill in the White House with nothing to do. Yikes. Russert asks him what it means, and Romney demurs and says America does not want a team. Talks Hillary raising taxes and that the Clintons are Washington and what is Washington is wrong. Compares himself to Reagan.

10:13: Russert asks about how much of his own money he spent. He says that he spent less than Corzine, Forbes, or Bloomberg. He refuses to answer. Says that he owes no one anything. Tries to turn it into an advantage. Russert pushes again about buying an election; Romney says he’s concerned about America. He cares!

10:14: Bri-Wi asks about 44% say a Mormon president would have problems uniting the country. Romney says it’s absurd, and he’s probably right, so I’m not going to write about it. Finishes with another attack on Clinton, comparing her to ‘the Europe of old.’ You heard it here, she wants to fund the Medicis!

10:17: Does Paul want to abolish Social Security? Yes, he says, but not overnight. He’d use military savings to fund it as long as it is needed and let the young people get out.

10:18: Huckabee is asked about saving Social Security. Huckabee wants to get off a joke about Romney’s sons that seems really out of place and seems beneath him, something I didn’t even think was possible 5 minutes ago. Huckabee says that the Fair Tax will save social security. When Russert points out its unlikely, Huckabee compares it to going to the moon. This is borderline delusional and Russert gives up.

10:20: Russert asks about Reagan raising the cap on the payroll tax. Romney says he won’t do that because it is a ‘double whammy’ in that hurts people and slows the economy. WHAMMY. Talks up personal account and a different calculation for wealthier Americans, and pushing the retirement age up. Says it will not change for anyone on or near retirement.

10:23: Why is Giuliani airing a campaign in Spanish? He says that he’s comfortable reaching out if a group of people speak another primary language. Segues as quickly as possible to illegal immigration to not embarrass himself further. Somehow adds that speaking other languages in a global economy is a good idea.

10:24: Giuliani is asked about wet foot dry foot law, and asks why there is a different policy than Iran or Venezuela. Giuliani says there is a presumption for Cuba that anyone fleeing is presumed to flee persecution. Does not really address wet foot dry foot.

10:26: Does Huckabee agree with what Norris said of McCain being too old? Huckabee jokes about Norris beating too old. Says that age is not a problem with McCain, and it is not an issue for him. Again, just a little too silly.

10:28: McCain jokes that he’s going to send Stallone to attack Norris. Now that’s appropriate.

10:29: The New York Times is endorsing McCain and Clinton; says that Giuliani’s arrogance is breathtaking. Giuliani attacks the New York Times to a smattering of applause and touts his record. Apparently forgetting the NYT defended him on those trips to see his now third wife.

10:30: Romney is asked about attacks on his flip flopping. He says he is not worried, and says he can point to his record.

10:32: McCain says his temper is not an issue. He takes time to say Giuliani is an American hero and that everyone is a good person.

10:33: Huckabee is asked about a quote that his faith giving a ‘queasy feeling.” Says that is not his problem, and in America you have to respect different opinions, even no faith; then says faith is really, really important.

10:34: Will Paul hurt the party with a 3rd party candidacy? He says he is more worried about Republicans keeping to their issues, and maybe people should be more worried. Says Republicans used to fight the Dept. of Education and used to fight to stop wars. Says being strict on the Constitution is important. He’s getting really ignored tonight, not one cheap shot. The Paulites again break the agreement and cheer; it’s clear its about 15 people in the entire audience.

Bri-Wi wraps up by thanking everyone. And we’re out. Hope you enjoyed it.